KIA HUM QAID-E-AZAM KO KAFIR KEHTAY HAIN ? (MA'AZALLAH)

[Ghulam E Mustafa]

PLEASE MUJHE KOI ISLAMI BHAI ISS BARAY MAIN FATWA MANGWA KAR DAI K ULAMA-E-AHLE SUNNAT QAID-E-AZAM KO MUSALMAAN MANTAY HAIN YA KAFIR KYON KI AIK DEOBANDI NE KAHA AGHAR TUM FATWA MANGWA DO K ULAMA-E-AHL-E-SUNNAT UNHAIN MUSLIM MANTAY HAIN TU WOH APNE BAZURGOON KI KAHEE HOI BATAIN MAAN JAI GA.

MAGHAR ALHUMDULLILAH MERA YEH IMAN HAI K QAID-E-AZAM JAISA MUSALMAAN BHI KABHI KABHI ISS DUNYA MAIN ATTA HAI.

[Madinah_Madinah]

me ny b suna tha kisi sy k Muhammad Ali Jinnah sahi bndy nhe thy..........

pta nhe ye baat kahan tk durust hy......

 

wesy mery khayal me........kisi shakhs....khususan mary huay ki zaat me aaib dhoondny ki koshish krna

hamen kiya kisi k aiboon sy.....??

 

WALLAHU TA'ALA AALAMU WA RASOOLUHU AALAM wa

[Ghulam E Mustafa]

me ny b suna tha kisi sy k Muhammad Ali Jinnah sahi bndy nhe thy..........

pta nhe ye baat kahan tk durust hy......

 

wesy mery khayal me........kisi shakhs....khususan mary huay ki zaat me aaib dhoondny ki koshish krna

hamen kiya kisi k aiboon sy.....??

 

WALLAHU TA'ALA AALAMU WA RASOOLUHU AALAM wa

 

App ne tu phir kisi wahabi say hee sunna ho ga kam say kam aik Pakistani Muslim unn k baray main aisa nahi keh sakta woh tu aik Azeem Insaan aur aik Azeem Musalman thay aur unn per humare Ulama-e-Ahl-e-Sunnat ne kai Books bhi likhi hain jinn main say meray pass bhi aik hai k '' Qaid-e-Azam ka Maslak ''

[Qufl e Madinah]

 

 

 

Quaid e Azam k Baray main Mufti Haroon Qadri Attari(Faizan e Attar site walay)jo farmatay hain wo aap is Attachment file say sun lain......

 

3167.mp3

 

[Abdur Rehman]

 

Tehreeke Azaidi Hindi aur Mashaikh o Ulema ka Kirdar: http://www.islamieducation.com/islamic-lib...e-hind-aur.html

 

 

 

 

Wasslam

[Ubaid-e-Raza]

.. thanx 4 sharing.

[Haq Haider]

ASALAM O ALIKUM BROTHERS...

YAAR AAP KUCH KAMEEENY LOGGON KE WAJA SE MULK-E-PAKISTAN K HER DIL AZEEZ SHAKSIYAT PER SHAKK KER RAHY HAIN ..... YEA NA MURAAD TOU NAU ZU BILLAH RASOOL-E-KAREEM(SUA) PER B SHAKK KERTY HAIN .. TOU KYA NAU ZU BILLAH AB HUM IN KE WAJA SE ...ASTAGFAAR ASTAGFAAR RASOOL E KAREEM (SUA) PER KESY SHAKK KER SAKTY HAIN .. UN PER SHAKK KERNA HAI KUFER MAI SHAMIL HO GA ..... DEKHOO BHAI JAB B HAQ AATA HAI BATIL ZAROOR AATA HAI ..HAAN WESY HUMAIN IN BAYGAIRTOON KA MOOH TOUR JAWAB DAYNA CHAHIYEE MAGER SHAKK NAHI ..

BCOZ APKO BATATA CHALOO K SHAKK HAMESHA KUFER KE TARAF LAY KER JATA HAI ..

FOR EXAMPLE: YEA ADMI LAMBA HAI YA CHOTA...MOTA HAI YA PATLA...HALALI HAI YA HARAMI ...GORA HAI YA......????

YAHI BAAT HAI K SHAKK HAMESHA PASTI KE TARAF LAY KER JATA HAI ..AAP KO IN BAYGAIRTOON KA JAWAB ZAROOR DAYNA CHAHIYE E MAGHER AISI SHAKSIYAT PER SHAKK KER K AAP APNY IMAM KO B THES POHNCHA SAKTY HAIN ...qaid-e-azam jesa insaan duniya ko na is se pehle kabhi mila aur na mily ga..

[Haq Haider]

Bhai loag yea Loag tou apny baap per b shakk ker sakty hain ,mager halali ke yea pehchan nahi ......

 

Halali kabhi b Namak harami nahi kerta ... .....

 

Wa aakhir Khudawa aanil Hamdolillah -e- Rabil ala meen ..

 

Labaik Ya Rasool ALLAh (PBUH)

[Sumreen]

aap logon ne bilkul theek farmaaya qaide aazam to bohat azeem insaan the un ki mehnaton se hamain pakistan mila or wo baad main ahlesunnat main ho gai the.

[ata_ho_ghame_madina]

g mery father bhi khte hain wo ismili thy

 

aur JO MUKHI HOTA HAY JAMAT KHANA KA OS NE JNAHA SB KEY MUHN PE THEPER BHI MARA THA

 

ktne achey thy janah sb key onho ne ismilii ko choor dia

[Ghulam E Mustafa]

Aslam o Alikum Bhaio aur Behno,

Iss masla per maine kafi kuch para hai aur meray pass aik Book hai '' Quaid-e-Azam ka Maslik '' uss main kafi hawalajat diye gai hain ke Quaid-e-Azam Barelvi thay aur har saal Eid-e-Milad manaty aur Barelvion ki masjid main namaz party aur Deoband ke khilaf thay i think shaid isse wajah say Deobandion ne unn ko kafir-e-azam kaha hai.

Kafi achi book hai woh mujhe kafi passand aai.

Allah inn Badmazhabon ko hadayat ata farmai. ameen

[Mudasir Yaseen]

Mere Bhai aaj aap ko aik aissi baat batta raha hoon k jo k buhat kam log hee jante hain, kitaab ka abhi naam yaad naheen hai. InshaAlalh un ki scanning kr wa kr yahaan upload karoon ga.

 

Baat ye hai k "Quaid E A'azam Muhammed Ali Jinaah Alaih Rehmat na sirf Saheeh ul Aqeeda sunni thay, balike un ko Khuwaab men Huzoor E Akram, Noor - Mujassam ka deedar b naseeb huwa tha."

[Mudasir Yaseen]

Is k ilawah Quaid e A'azam ne Allama Molana Abd us Sattar khan Niyazi se b buhat mut'asir thay. un k liye Quaid E A'azam ne kaha tha k "Jis Tehreek E Pakistan men Abd dus Sattar khan Niyazi jaise No Jawaan hon, us Pakistan ko banine se naheen rok sakta."

 

Aik aur baat b k "Sarhadd men se Congress, gaandhi, aur un k chhore hue cheelon (Deobandi molvi) ka asar o Rusookh khatam karne k liye Quaid E Azam ne Allama Abd ul Haamid Bidayuni Alaih Rehmat ko Sarhad Dora karne k liye bheja tha. Aap Alaih Rehmat ne na sirf Congresiyon ka asar o rusookh khatam kiya tha, balike wahaan logon k zihnon ko Muslim League aur Qayam e Pakistan supporting ki taraf b ma'il kiya tha. Halanke Sarhadd men aik aur Congress Nawaz Khan Ghaffar Khan ( ALM'aroof "Bacha Khan") b tha.

[Muhammad Furqan]

Next time ISI will be taking care of me as you read it... but well.

 

Mr Jinnah. I am not so sure about him, He did 'very brilliant job' that he gifted us Pakistan (now this depends on us about how worst we are about maintaining our country). But as per best of my Information, Personality of Jinnah and my research returns that he was either a twelver or Ismaili.

 

No one should be unaware about story of his daughter, Dina Wadia....

 

I am not saying this ->>> you are not reading this ->>> "That was shameful enough".

 

Married a Non Muslims?? Living in India?? Her Son, Grand son of Jinnah is Christian?? WHAT THE HECK!!!

 

We should also be aware of Rafzi weapon called "Taqiyya". Best example of this forum is regarding Aamir Liaquat Hussain. If he wasn't following twelver beliefs, There are no proofs of he being Sunni. I'd compare his personality with Bhutto. Secular Ideology. But again, As per best of my information and depenable resources like Wikipedia confirms that he was Twelver.

 

What does Ulma-e-Deoband have to say about Twelver Rafzis???

 

Facts!!

 

Even he made Pakistan. PAKISTAN THAT TIME WAS NOT ISLAMIC STATE. Pakistan was ran by British until 1956. Yes our president, Cheif Military Officer were english british + non muslim until that time. We were in control of British queen. Did you know it? I ask why we needed to wait such 11+ years to be recognized as Islamic state? He had whole 1 year to do this. But he didn't.

 

And I remember Shah Turab ul-Haq Qadri said same thing that he did good enough for making Pakistan. But Even If he would have taken his step Back, there were always Ulma-e-Ahlesunnat to make Pakistan. He also gave name of all of them. Search KhazinatulIman on ahlesunnat.net ... I think questions was regarding put "" next to him or accepting Jinnah as "Wali" but Answer was most likely negative..

 

Also, I cant remember, But I found is somewhere on net: Not hard to find another lawyer. (OMG, that was not me. Lol)

 

...

...

 

I no need no emotions, Facts will do. Please correct me.

 

No offence, I say truth. Yes he did great work (once again) but why did he built himself a "palatial mansion" at that time?? 2 Lakh rupees of that time in Mombay.

 

Some more facts...

1. His daugther denied Pakistan.

2. Nation denied his Sister (political issue)

 

Ending with:

 

Thank you Bani-e-Pakistan (instead of Quaid-e-Azam) for making Pakistan. I have no comments for you, Nor good nor bad. But yet Thank you. Now we should stop discussing it otherwise next time we open our eye, We will be having our ..censor.. kicked by ISI agencies.

 

 

...Huq ki baat kehnay ka duniya nay naam Bagawat rakha hai.

Edited 10 مئی 2008 by Muhammad Furqan

[Muhammad Furqan]

I am Pakistani. But I will be immigrating to Europe soon, Insh'Allah. Tired of living a "Pakistani" life. The only day I feel proud is either 23rd March or 14th August only.

Edited 10 مئی 2008 by Muhammad Furqan

[سگِ عطار]

Personality of Jinnah and my research returns that he was either a twelver or Ismaili.

 

Ismaili Kafir Hain... Tu Aapko Chahye Key Aap Apni Research Per Koi Mazboot Daleel Pesh Kerein... Jabkey Unki Tauba Ka Qaul Milta Hai.. Jab Tak Koi Saheeh Daleel Na Mil Jaye Tu Unki Tauba Ko Jhoota Kesey Kaha Ja Sakta Hai?

 

No one should be unaware about story of his daughter, Dina Wadia....

I am not saying this ->>> you are not reading this ->>> "That was shameful enough".

Married a Non Muslims?? Living in India?? Her Son, Grand son of Jinnah is Christian?? WHAT THE HECK!!!

 

Tu Kiya Unki Beti Ki Wajah Sey Unki Taubah Ghair Motabar Ho Gayi? Hazrat Sayiduna Nooh Ka Beta Kafir Ho Gaya... Tu ...................?

 

We should also be aware of Rafzi weapon called "Taqiyya". Best example of this forum is regarding Aamir Liaquat Hussain. If he wasn't following twelver beliefs, There are no proofs of he being Sunni.

 

Amir Liaqat Ager Shia Ko Kafir wa Gumrah Samjhta Tu Un Key Sath Sulah Na Kerta Jo Uskey Afaal Sey Zahir Hai.. Uska Taqiyya Tu Yoon Lagta Hai.. In Per Kiya Daleel Hai Key Taubah Mein Taqiyyah Tha?

 

I'd compare his personality with Bhutto. Secular Ideology. But again, As per best of my information and depenable resources like Wikipedia confirms that he was Twelver.

 

Meri Malomaat Key Mutabiq Seculer Honey Mein Bhi Confirm Daleel Koi Nhin Hai Jabkey Pakistan Ban'ney Key Baad Islam Ko Chupaya Nhin Ja Raha Tha.. Ager Isko Angraiz Dosti Ya Un Sey Ta'aulqat Rakhney Ki Wajah Sey Kaha Jaye Tu Is Sey Unka Islam Tu Ghair Motabar Sabit Nhin Hota.. Hamarey Mojodah Hukmraan Sab Angraizon Key Ghulam Nazer Aatey Hain Tu Kiya Unka Islam Bhi Ghair Motabar Maana Jaye Ga?

 

Aur Jahan Tak Wikipedia Ki Bat Hai.. Tu Internet Per Sab Sey Ghair Motabar Malomati Zareya Wikipedia Hai.. Jahan Jo Chahey Apni Merzi Sey Add Ker Sakta Hai Aur Jiski Post Chahey Edit Ki Ja Sakti Hai.. Security key Liye Sirf Editor ka IP Log Hoti Hai Jis Key Liye Internet Ney Hi 1000 IP Changer Farhaam Kiye Howey Hain... Aur IP Changer Key Baghair Bhi Tabdeeli Sey Kisi Ko Kabhi Koi Saza Ki Khabar Nhin Suni..

 

Even he made Pakistan. PAKISTAN THAT TIME WAS NOT ISLAMIC STATE. Pakistan was ran by British until 1956. Yes our president, Cheif Military Officer were english british + non muslim until that time. We were in control of British queen. Did you know it? I ask why we needed to wait such 11+ years to be recognized as Islamic state? He had whole 1 year to do this. But he didn't.

And I remember Shah Turab ul-Haq Qadri said same thing that he did good enough for making Pakistan.

 

Yeh New Malomat Hain Merey Liye... Ager Yeh Such Bhi Hain tu Kiya Is Sey Unka Islam Ghair Motabar Sabit Hota Hai? Kiya Aap Shah Turab ul Haq Qadri Sahib Ka Yeh Clip Post Ker Saktey Hain?

 

I think questions was regarding put "" next to him or accepting Jinnah as "Wali" but Answer was most likely negative..

 

Shah Sahib ney Kiya Unko Ismaili Kaha..? Maybe Ho Sakta Hai Shah Sahib Ka Un Se Siyasi Base Per Ikhtilaf Hoo.. Yani Jo Siyasat Unho Ney Ki Shah Sahib Uskey Haq Mein Na Hoon..

 

 

No offence, I say truth. Yes he did great work (once again) but why did he built himself a "palatial mansion" at that time?? 2 Lakh rupees of that time in Mombay.

 

Some more facts...

1. His daugther denied Pakistan.

2. Nation denied his Sister (political issue)

 

Yahi Sarey Siyasi Ikhtilafat Hain.. Mager Yahan Bat Unki Siyasat Unki Daughter ya Unki Sister Key Barey Mein Nhin Ho Rahi... Balkey Unkey Eman Key Barey mein Ho Rahi Hai.. Aur In Baton Sey Eman tu Ghair Motabar Sabit Nhin Ho Raha Jab Tak Key Saheeh Motabar Daleel Na Pesh Ki Jaye...

 

...Huq ki baat kehnay ka duniya nay naam Bagawat rakha hai.

 

Haq Ki Baat Ager Bila Daleel Kahi Jaye Tu Baghawat Nhin Kehtey Balkey Baad Mein Ager Saboot Na Pesh Kiya Ja Sakey Tu Jhoot Kehtey Hain...

 

Ager Ba Daleel Kahi Jaye Aur Phir Radd Ker Diya Jaye Tu Baghawat Kaha Ja Sakta Hai.. Ager Aap Ney Jo Sab Sey Pehley Unkey Eman Key Barey Mein Likha Hai Is Per Motabar Daleel Pesh Ker Dein Tu Aapki Bat Sahi Sabit Ho Sakti Hai.. Baqi Siyasat Aur Unkey Baqi Muam'lat Aik Alag Cheez Hai...

 

Request: Tamam Members Sey Request Hai... Baghair Emotional Howey Discussion Kerein... Ba Daleel Yahan Her Kisi Ko Izhaar-e-Raye Ki Ijazat Hai.. Ager Kisi Ki Baat Sey Ikhtilaf Bhi Ho Tu Adab Key Dairey Mein Reh Ker Kerein..

[Ya Mohammadah]

Mohammad_Ali_Jina_wasn_t_wali_allah.rm

[Muhammad Furqan]

Ismaili Kafir Hain... Tu Aapko Chahye Key Aap Apni Research Per Koi Mazboot Daleel Pesh Kerein... Jabkey Unki Tauba Ka Qaul Milta Hai.. Jab Tak Koi Saheeh Daleel Na Mil Jaye Tu Unki Tauba Ko Jhoota Kesey Kaha Ja Sakta Hai?

 

 

 

Tu Kiya Unki Beti Ki Wajah Sey Unki Taubah Ghair Motabar Ho Gayi? Hazrat Sayiduna Nooh Ka Beta Kafir Ho Gaya... Tu ...................?

 

 

 

Amir Liaqat Ager Shia Ko Kafir wa Gumrah Samjhta Tu Un Key Sath Sulah Na Kerta Jo Uskey Afaal Sey Zahir Hai.. Uska Taqiyya Tu Yoon Lagta Hai.. In Per Kiya Daleel Hai Key Taubah Mein Taqiyyah Tha?

 

 

 

Meri Malomaat Key Mutabiq Seculer Honey Mein Bhi Confirm Daleel Koi Nhin Hai Jabkey Pakistan Ban'ney Key Baad Islam Ko Chupaya Nhin Ja Raha Tha.. Ager Isko Angraiz Dosti Ya Un Sey Ta'aulqat Rakhney Ki Wajah Sey Kaha Jaye Tu Is Sey Unka Islam Tu Ghair Motabar Sabit Nhin Hota.. Hamarey Mojodah Hukmraan Sab Angraizon Key Ghulam Nazer Aatey Hain Tu Kiya Unka Islam Bhi Ghair Motabar Maana Jaye Ga?

 

Aur Jahan Tak Wikipedia Ki Bat Hai.. Tu Internet Per Sab Sey Ghair Motabar Malomati Zareya Wikipedia Hai.. Jahan Jo Chahey Apni Merzi Sey Add Ker Sakta Hai Aur Jiski Post Chahey Edit Ki Ja Sakti Hai.. Security key Liye Sirf Editor ka IP Log Hoti Hai Jis Key Liye Internet Ney Hi 1000 IP Changer Farhaam Kiye Howey Hain... Aur IP Changer Key Baghair Bhi Tabdeeli Sey Kisi Ko Kabhi Koi Saza Ki Khabar Nhin Suni..

 

 

 

Yeh New Malomat Hain Merey Liye... Ager Yeh Such Bhi Hain tu Kiya Is Sey Unka Islam Ghair Motabar Sabit Hota Hai? Kiya Aap Shah Turab ul Haq Qadri Sahib Ka Yeh Clip Post Ker Saktey Hain?

 

 

 

Shah Sahib ney Kiya Unko Ismaili Kaha..? Maybe Ho Sakta Hai Shah Sahib Ka Un Se Siyasi Base Per Ikhtilaf Hoo.. Yani Jo Siyasat Unho Ney Ki Shah Sahib Uskey Haq Mein Na Hoon..

 

 

 

 

Yahi Sarey Siyasi Ikhtilafat Hain.. Mager Yahan Bat Unki Siyasat Unki Daughter ya Unki Sister Key Barey Mein Nhin Ho Rahi... Balkey Unkey Eman Key Barey mein Ho Rahi Hai.. Aur In Baton Sey Eman tu Ghair Motabar Sabit Nhin Ho Raha Jab Tak Key Saheeh Motabar Daleel Na Pesh Ki Jaye...

 

 

 

Haq Ki Baat Ager Bila Daleel Kahi Jaye Tu Baghawat Nhin Kehtey Balkey Baad Mein Ager Saboot Na Pesh Kiya Ja Sakey Tu Jhoot Kehtey Hain...

 

Ager Ba Daleel Kahi Jaye Aur Phir Radd Ker Diya Jaye Tu Baghawat Kaha Ja Sakta Hai.. Ager Aap Ney Jo Sab Sey Pehley Unkey Eman Key Barey Mein Likha Hai Is Per Motabar Daleel Pesh Ker Dein Tu Aapki Bat Sahi Sabit Ho Sakti Hai.. Baqi Siyasat Aur Unkey Baqi Muam'lat Aik Alag Cheez Hai...

 

Request: Tamam Members Sey Request Hai... Baghair Emotional Howey Discussion Kerein... Ba Daleel Yahan Her Kisi Ko Izhaar-e-Raye Ki Ijazat Hai.. Ager Kisi Ki Baat Sey Ikhtilaf Bhi Ho Tu Adab Key Dairey Mein Reh Ker Kerein..

 

Ya baat to clear hai kay aap logon kay mutabiq Jinnah pahlay Islamaili thay. To ya aap ko sabit karna ho ga kai he converted. As a hint, Ya hi baat ap kissi Ismaili, Parsi, Twelver forum pay ja kar pocho. Jinnah ka relegion disputed hai. Again, he had secular Ideology like Bhutto (when I mean secular, I mean with in range of sectors in Islam).

 

Aaur ma nay Facts likhay hain.. Jinnah kay relegion per to mai nai aik ya do line hi likhi hain aur aik warning message. Kher, Aaap ki malomat kay liya Wikipedia is collection of several books and quotes. Vali Nasr in his Shia Revival book also claimed that he was shia. All edits in wikipeida is temporary and are "moderated" in regular bases.

 

And here is american research:

http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?articl...er_and_the_west

 

Jinnah, Bhutto were both Shia and to be able to achive power, Naturally or intentionally both behaved and represented Secular Ideology, This is the reason that Pakistan was made but with out constitution.

[Muhammad Furqan]

 

What difference you find in my saying and Shah Turab ul-Haq's saying? He also call him Bani-e-Pakistan. Asker asked as Quaid-e-Azam (nope).

 

and he said hum on ko koi wali, koi laqab nahi datay....

 

What do you except me or Shah Turab to say??

 

OMG, He was a kaafir... This is what you want either to say? We say it and we are in trouble. and of course not me, Shah Turab ul-Haq is well known personality in Pakistan. If we "DONT WANT" to be clear about Jinnah that means we are living in Pakistan. makes sense? As Shah Turab ul-Huq only quoted him as "Wakil" means a Layer.

 

He is disputed personality. If you are living in Pakistan, you don't want to discuss it. trust me.

 

Issi mulk Pakistan mai Hudood Ordinance pass hoa. Yahan per to sunni majority hai lakn due to Roshan Khiyali of Bhutto and Karachi Dare Devils it was issued. Semi-Shia Ideology. Leadership abhi bhi sunniyon kay pass nahi hai.

Edited 11 مئی 2008 by Muhammad Furqan

[Mudasir Yaseen]

Jinnah, Bhutto were both Shia and to be able to achive power, Naturally or intentionally both behaved and represented Secular Ideology, This is the reason that Pakistan was made but with out constitution.

 

Hey, Listen brother, lagta hai aap kissi ko "SHIA" banate hue dair naheen karte. Aap k pass kia proof hai k "Bhutto" Shai tha ???

Jaldi se proof den, k "WO Shia tha, aur us k AQA'ID Shaion wale thay."

 

Aur agar aap aik b proof na de sakkay, to atleast astagfaar zaroor kar leejiye ga, k "Aap ne kissi Sunni Saheeh ul Aqeeda Musalimaan ko "SHIA" kaha hai. Agar aap proof naheen la sakke to Mein aap ko proofs doonga k "Bhutto aur us ki Olaad Shia naheen balike Sunni thay."

1973 ka constitution kis ne diya hum ko ??? Jis men Pahli martabba Qadiyaniyon ko Kaafir Qarrar diya gayya tha ???

Is se pahle b hukmiran aae, Lakin ye s'aadatt to "Bhutto" k naseeb men hee thee.

Edited 11 مئی 2008 by Mudasir Yaseen

[Muhammad Furqan]

Hey, Listen brother, lagta hai aap kissi ko "SHIA" banate hue dair naheen karte. Aap k pass kia proof hai k "Bhutto" Shai tha ???

Jaldi se proof den, k "WO Shia tha, aur us k AQA'ID Shaion wale thay."

 

Aur agar aap aik b proof na de sakkay, to atleast astagfaar zaroor kar leejiye ga, k "Aap ne kissi Sunni Saheeh ul Aqeeda Musalimaan ko "SHIA" kaha hai. Agar aap proof naheen la sakke to Mein aap ko proofs doonga k "Bhutto aur us ki Olaad Shia naheen balike Sunni thay."

 

Banazir ki maa, Bhutto ki wife. Imported from Iran, Made in Iran. Aur aap nay kitni Biogrpahy parhi hai?

 

http://www.nafella.com/naflogger/?LookingO...cale_corruption

http://faroutliers.blogspot.com/2006/10/pa...om-shia-to.html

http://www.michaeltotten.com/archives/001525.html

http://www.scribd.com/doc/1018605/Benazir-Bhuttos-Biography

 

Aap mujh ko prove karain kay wo sunni tha.. Or agar na kar sakay to app bhi wo hi karain jo aap nai mujh ko karnay ko kaha. Aap ko bhi Shia ko Sunni bataty sharam nahi aati.

Edited 11 مئی 2008 by Muhammad Furqan

[سگِ عطار]

السلام علیکم،

میں اپنے سُنی قارئین سے ایک بار پھر گزارش کروں گا کہ ڈسکشن کریں مگر ادب سے تاکہ ہمارے درمیان کوئی رنجش پیدا نہ ہو۔ اُمید ہے سب ممبرز خیال رکھیں گے۔

 

Ya baat to clear hai kay aap logon kay mutabiq Jinnah pahlay Islamaili thay. To ya aap ko sabit karna ho ga kai he converted

 

 

آپ نے اعلیٰ حضرت رضی اللہ عنہ کی کتاب حسام الحرمین پرھی ہے؟ سبحان السبوح پڑھی ہے؟ الکوکبۃ کیا آپ کو اسلام و کفر کے مسائل کا پتہ ہے کہ کس پر حکم کفر علماء کب لگاتے ہیں؟ اس میں کیا کیا احتیاطوں کو پیش نظر رکھا جاتا ہے؟ جس پر حکم کفر لگایا وہ کافر نہ ہوا تو لگانے والے پر کیا حکم ہوگا؟

 

آئیں میں آپ کو اعلیٰ حضرت علیہ الرحمہ کی احتیاط کا عالم دکھاتا ہوں۔امام احمد رضا بریلوی علیہ الرحمہ کی احتیاط کا یہ عالم ہے کہ ۹۰۳۱ھ میں رسالہ” سبحان السبوح“ پہلی بار شائع ہوا، اس میں گنگوھی صاحب اور قائلین امکان کذب پر اٹھتر وجہ سے لزوم کفر ثابت کیا ، لیکن تکفیر نہیں کی، ۶۱۳۱ھ میں رسالہ” الکوکبة الشہابیہ“ شائع ہوا، جس میں مولوی اسماعیل دہلوی(م۱۳۸۱ء) کے ستّر کفریات گھائے، لیکن تکفیر سے اجتناب ہی کیا۔

 

اس حقیقت کو خود امام احمد رضا بریلوی رحمتہ اﷲ علیہ نے یوں بیان فرمایا ہے:

” مسلمانو! یہ روشن ظاہر، واضح قاہر عبارات تمہارے پیش نظر ہیں، جنہیں چَھپے ہوئے دس دس اور بعض سترہ اور تصنیف کو اُنیس سال ہوئے اور ان دشنامیوں کی تکفیر تو اب چھ سال یعنی ۰۲۳۱ھ سے ہوئی ہے، جب سے ” المعتمد المستند“ چھپی، اب عبارات کو بغور نظر فرماﺅ اور اﷲ و رسول کے خوف کو سامنے رکھ کر انصاف کرو۔

یہ عبارتیں فقط اُن مفتریوں کی افتراءہی نہیں ردّ کرتیں بلکہ صراحةً صاف صاف شہادت دے رہی ہیں کہ ایسی عظیم احتیاط والے نے ہرگز ان دشنامیوں کو کافر نہ کہا، جب تک یقینی قطعی واضح روشن جلی طور سے اُن کا صریح کفر آفتاب سے زیادہ روشن نہ ہو لیا، جس میں اصلاً اصلاً ہرگز ہرگز کوئی گنجائش ، کوئی تاویل نہ نکل سکی۔

آخر یہ بندہ خدا وہی تو ہے جو ان کے اکابر پر ستر ستر وجہ سے لزوم کفر کا ثبوت دے کر یہی کہتا ہے کہ ہمیں ہمارے نبی صلی اﷲتعالیٰ علیہ وسلم نے اہل لا الہٰ الا اﷲ کی تکفیر سے منع فرمایا ہے، جب تک وجہ کفر آفتاب سے زیادہ روشن نہ ہوجائے اور حکم اسلام کے لئے اصلاً کوئی ضعیف سا ضعیف محمل بھی باقی نہ رہے۔

 

اعلیٰ حضرت علیہ الرحمہ فرماتے ہیں کہ جب تک کفر آفتاب سے زیادہ روشن نہ ہوجائے اور حکم اسلام کے لئے اصلاً کوئی ضعیف سا ضعیف محمل بھی باقی نہ رہے۔

 

اور آپ بلا دلیل بانئ پاکستان کو شیعہ اسماعیلی کہہ کر حکم کفر ثابت کر رہے ہیں۔۔ آپ کو پتہ ہے کہ اسماعیل دہلوی کے اتنے کفریات گنوانے کے باوجود اعلیٰ حضرت علیہ الرحمہ نے اس پر کفر کا فتویٰ نہ دیا اس لئے کہ اُس کی توبہ کا صرف قول ملتا تھا۔ کوئی ثبوت نہیں تھا کہ توبہ کی یا نہیں کی۔ مگر یہ ایک احتمال مل گیا جس کی وجہ سے اعلیٰ حضرت علیہ الرحمہ نے اُس پر حکم کفر نہ لگایا۔ اور آپ توبہ کے قول پر ثبوت مانگ رہے ہیں اور ثبوت نہ پیش کیا جا سکا تو سمجھو کہ وہ اسماعیلی کافر تھے۔ والعیاذ باللہ

 

برادر ۔۔ اسلام و کفر کے مسائل بہت پیچیدہ ہیں۔ شاہ تراب الحق صاحب قادری مدظلہ العالی آپ کی بات کو ہر گز ثابت نہیں کر رہا کیوں کہ ہم بھی بانی پاکستان کو ولی اللہ نہیں کہتے۔ اور رضی اللہ عنہ یا رحمۃ اللہ علیہ لکھنے میں بھی ہمارا آپ سے کوئی اختلاف نہیں ہے۔ اور جہاں تک سیاست اور اُن کی گھریلوں زندگی کی بات ہے تو اس پر ہماری بحث ہی نہیں ہے۔

 

جس چیز پر بحث ہے کہ کیا بانئ پاکستان کافر تھے یا نہیں؟ اس پر آپ قائد اعظم کے اسماعیلی ہونے کی دلیل پیش کریں اور اگر بلا دلیل آپ ایسا کہیں گے تو بطور پیر بھائی میں آپ کو پھر نصیحت کروں گا کہ ایسا نہ کہیں۔ کہ یہاں تو خود علمائے اہلسنت نے کتابوں میں اُن کی توبہ کا قول نقل کیا ہے۔ جبکہ اعلیٰ حضرت علیہ الرحمہ تو ضعیف سے ضعیف احتمال پر بھی حکم کفر لگانے سے احتیاط کر رہے ہیں۔

[سگِ عطار]

If we "DONT WANT" to be clear about Jinnah that means we are living in Pakistan. makes sense? As Shah Turab ul-Huq only quoted him as "Wakil" means a Layer.

برادر قائد اعظم کا لفظی ترجمہ ہوتا ہے پوری ملت کا رہبر۔ اور ظاہر ہے پوری ملت کے رہبر تو علماء ہیں ہمارے اعلیٰ حضرت ہیں جنھوں نے سب سے پہلے دو قومی نظریہ پیش کیا۔

 

کیا آپ اس لئے بانئ پاکستان کو اسماعیلی کہیں گے کہ شاہ تراب الحق صاحب نے انھیں ولی کی بجائے وکیل کہا۔ یہ تو عجیب قیاس کہلائے گا۔ میرے خیال میں آپ شاہ صاحب سے پرسنلی بات کرلیں تو زیادہ بہتر رہے گا بجائے اس کے کہ آپ بانئ پاکستان کو اسماعیلی کہہ کر اُن پر حکم کفر ثابت کریں۔ باقی اعلیٰ حضرت علیہ الرحمہ کی احتیاط کا عالم میں نے آپ کو بتا دیا۔

 

Issi mulk Pakistan mai Hudood Ordinance pass hoa. Yahan per to sunni majority hai lakn due to Roshan Khiyali of Bhutto and Karachi Dare Devils it was issued. Semi-Shia Ideology. Leadership abhi bhi sunniyon kay pass nahi hai.

 

حدود آرڈیننس بل تو جنرل مشرف نے پاس کیا۔ کس مفتی صاحب نے حکم کفر لگایا؟ آپ سیاسی ڈسکشن اور دینی ڈسکشن میں یہ بات مدنظر رکھیں کہ ہم بات اسلام و کفر پر کر رہے ہیں۔ نہ کہ کسی کے گناہ یا بے گناہی پر۔۔۔

[Muhammad Furqan]

Main nai to sirf aap ko Facts bayan karay hain. Na hi may nay Jinnah kay mutaliq "Kaafir" ka lafz istaimal nahi kiya hai. Ya bhi fact hai kai Jinnah disputed personality hain. Again, May nay to sirf facts bayan karay hain. Agar aap on ko galat sabit kar saktay hain to mehar bani.

Edited 11 مئی 2008 by Muhammad Furqan

[Muhammad Furqan]

Haqeeqat to ya hai kai Aaap chahay Darul Ifta Ahelsunant say pocho ya Shah Turab ul-Haq ko email karo. Koi bhi kaafir nahi kahay ga, Kyon kay on ko Pakistan mai hi rehna hai. Haan agar koi prominent scholar Sunni keh day to mai maan loon ga.

Edited 11 مئی 2008 by Muhammad Furqan